Disappointment

[MoonBlazE]

http://www.jazz2online.com/J2Ov2/downloads/info.php?levelID=3501

This upload of mine were given 8 reviews, telling nothing about the levels' content and lacking a rating. Instead of actual reviews a sort of conversation about the upload was started, discussing the being of a sequel.

Although the pack was not completed, I still spent weeks creating, testing, and fixing those levels. There isn't anything worth in doing and uploading levels if all you get in reward is a couple of confused users ranting about your upload. Funniest of all is that 2 administrators, who also appears to be some of the best reviewers, also joined the discussion without leaving a review in the end.

This have never happened before the review limit was removed. I'm also suprised to see exactly the same kind of conversation at the 'gg no re' level pack uploaded:

http://www.jazz2online.com/J2Ov2/downloads/info.php?levelID=3510

Is Jazz2Online turning into some kind of chatroom or did I just miss something?

[White Rabbit]

Ppl are too lazy to review but don't want to appear to be lazy, so they just put their opinions down and then "leave the lvl be until they got time". gg no re, however, is not that similar because most of the reviews there are of TF members and we're just trying to sort out bugs while making a lot of noise at the same time. :p I have deleted my reviews (only 1 left, which needs to remain there until it is read by those the review has targetted) and the Total Freaks account's reviews have been merged. Unhit's review should be deleted any day now, but the rest, I'm afraid, is out of our control. I think that gg no re discussion should be kept to the TF forums now, but my lvl thread has been inactive ever since the upload of gg no re.

[Slaz]

Is Jazz2Online turning into some kind of chatroom or did I just miss something?

Sometimes i see these discussions, but in this download it was going to be TOO far i see. ;-)

[White Rabbit]

gg no re is worse than TDI 2. ;)

[LittleFreak]

I played it, but never had time to review it. So here goes:

Playability:
The level pack was very nice to play, there were many cool puzzles, most of them were quite original. The items were placed very well, and so were the enemies most of the time, somtimes they were a bit unfair though. I liked the boss fight in the last level.
Rating: 8.5

Creativity:
The levels were really creative, I especially liked the several puzzles (like I already said). The only thing that dissapointed me a bit was the first level, it could've been a tad bit longer, not just an endboss fight. The rest was really fine, and there were some great ideas.
Rating: 8.5

Balance:
The levels were well balanced, not too easy but also not to hard. Exception is again the first level, where there is a fire shield in easy mode, which makes it too easy.
Rating: 8.

Eyecandy:
The eyecandy was different than the one from TDI 1, it wasn't as confusing as in the first pack, but it was also not as good as in the first pack. The eyecandy was not bad, but it doesn't reach TDI1. A lot of people complained about the eyecandy in TDI1 because it was very confusing at times, but it didn't disturb me either. However, you still did a good job on eyecandy which is worth a 7.5 I think.
Rating: 7.5

Story:
The levels mostly lacked most story elements, the only thing I knew from the first level is that I had to find the forbidden area. An expection is the last level, where it looks like Devan tells Bolly to kill Jazz, which looks kinda cool. The levels could've had more story elements though.
Rating: 7.0

I hope you are satisfied with this review, even though it is not all that detailed. I liked your episode and it would be cool if it was finished, good job!
I think it deserves an 8.0 overall, and I hope to see more work from you in the future.

[Newspaz]

There should be some "Report this to moderator" link around there. Don't ask me where it is though.

[LittleFreak]

Well, I saw all posts except my review, a "this is quite good" from Satan and a post from MoonBlaze himself were deleted. It would still be nice if someone else could make a review too, as I know how dissapointing it is to work hard on something like this and all you get is 10 posts with no real feedback in them.

[Unhit]

Yeah, it's somewhat sad :(
But it will become better I'm sure :D

[LittleFreak]

It will become better if we all review a bit more. Some time ago I reviewed a lot, but at the moment I'm very tired and hardly ever review something.

We could probably start a "Players and Reviewers Board" topic. I saw such a topic in another game forum, and it worked quite well.

[White Rabbit]

It's just that ppl are very busy creating their own lvls or minding their own business. They don't feel like reviewing because it takes up too much time and short, undetailed reviews are no longer allowed (I used to say stuff like "Don't expect me to write a proper review on a Saturday" and then rate a lvl 7.5 :p) on J2o. Ppl must be patient for their ratings these days. :(

[Slaz]

I only review levels when i haven't anything more to do...

[blurredd]

But you could get more reviews simply by setting up a review exchange system. You review someone else's download and they review yours. More reviews for everyone. It would certainly work better than complaining about the review system in a JCF. <strike>Not to mention you don't review too often yourself nowadays, MB.</strike> But I do agree that removal of the review limit does allow for more useless posts and chaos.

[DoubleGJ]

I just don't have time to play TDI2. But I'll try. And after that's done, I can write a review.

[Unhit]

Review exchange...you give me a 10 and I'll do the same :P
Dunno :S

[LittleFreak]

What BlurredD said was a nice thought, but the problem is some people don't upload things really often at all. I didn't upload something for ages.

[blurredd]

You only need to ask those with a fairly recent upload, which shouldn't be too hard. You would be restricted as to who reviews your download, but it's still better than nothing.

[Unhit]

Yeah, that's true, too.

[LittleFreak]

I got a 1.00 score for my review on TDI2. I'M SO GOOD! ;-D

[White Rabbit]

Review exchange? Tried that, didn't work. :p

[LittleFreak]

I wonder where MoonBlaze is. At least a little "Thank you for the stupid review which didn't make sense at all, but it's there!" would be nice. d-:

[MoonBlazE]

Why should I? I'm giving you a lot of joy by sharing my work, reviewing is the way to thank the creator for his upload.

BlurredD, not everyone is in time and place to write up reviews every now and then, should they be denied serious feedback because of that? I like to review and will certainly do some when I get the time, but seeing worse uploads getting far better feedback than I makes me wonder if it's really worth creating it in the first place.

I know that people may not have had the time, but it really seems like people just played it and then dusted it from their memory. That's not being fair to me.

[Slaz]

I know that people may not have had the time, but it really seems like people just played it and then dusted it from their memory. That's not being fair to me.

That's off course not what i should do, even if i haven't many time, and downloaded a level, i still make a review, but only something faster... :rolleyes:

[blurredd]

You also have to keep in mind that you're asking for a review for four levels, and seeing how everyone's becoming lazy (including myself) and can't get away with short reviews, a little extra incentive would be needed. Without incentive, your next best bet is begging inviduals to review your pack, which could be a lot more frustrating.

But I don't know what else to say. Reviewing a lot of levels does get boring after while.

[Blackraptor]

Heh. I've got the same (almost) problem. 53 downloads in the past 3 days, but no reviews. That's what I get for uploading a 15 level pack. Aaah. What happend to the days where people used to give packs like these 20 reviews (even if they were three or four sentences, at least some feedback is nice) to these things.

[Stijn]

Heh. I've got the same (almost) problem. 53 downloads in the past 3 days, but no reviews. That's what I get for uploading a 15 level pack. Aaah. What happend to the days where people used to give packs like these 20 reviews (even if they were three or four sentences, at least some feedback is nice) to these things.
Too bad short reviews aren't allowed anymore.

[LittleFreak]

@ Blacky: I'd give a review, but the problem is I can't play online and so could not review most of the levels, as, for example, I have nobody playing CTF with me. The first SP level was nice, I liked the puzzles. A story would be good though. The second one is very Jazz biased. The trap at the start took me ages to get through with Spaz (the one with the springs and the "flames" above). When using Jazz I just used my heli-ears and got through it in no time. Also I think the level is a bit unfair, for example the part with the spike platforms, which I couldn't deal with at all. I did not check out the other two SPs yet. For the multiplayer levels, as I said I did not check most of them (checking them in Single Player would be pointless at all). The battle level lacks layer 8 background which looks kinda weird. I guess it should be an effect, but I don't like it at all because it's very confusing. Instead put translucent tiles in layer 8. The race levels were kinda confusing too.

@ MoonBlaze: I know it's nice from you to share your work with us. However, I still think a little thanks could be nice. It's the same for reviewing. People don't like writing reviews for nothing.

You're asking why you should make levels if nobody reviews them.
I'm asking why I should write reviews if nobody acknowlegdes them.

However, don't misunderstand me. It's not that important for me to get a thanks for my rather small review.

[White Rabbit]

gg no re has fallen into the same fate. :( So many DLs, no reviews!

I do have a few review suggestions (anyone with over 100 reviews under their belt should :p).

If you don't want to write a lot, write concisely. You don't have to use fancy words or complex sentences nor do you have to write down a lot of detail. Stick to the bare minumum, write very quickly and with typos if you're really desperate for speed.

Here are some example sentences concerning gameplay, eyecandy, flow and weapons placement (reviews of tilesets can be written in a similar fashion but I'm more comfortable reviewing lvls):

First, just write some subtitles. It's not at all original, but remember that you want speed, not quality. Quality almost never comes with speed. :p

Gameplay
Now list a few points. 3 is the minimum points, imo, or the admins will eat you.
1. Describe the gameplay. Is it jumpy? Does it have a lot of suckertubes? How are the springs placed?
2. Also, tell your opinion and say why it's good/not good. Just state some stuff like "springs aren't placed in good positions", "the platforms are too far apart", "the suckertubes are good, they're always easy to reach but players do not depend on them for movement", etc. These are just guidelines, don't use them all the time because lvls are different.
3. Suggest improvements. This is probably the most useful to the author. Tell them where a badly placed spring could go instead, what stuff there should be in the lvl that would improve it, etc. You must, of course, be able to understand everything you advise to the author, or you could be telling them to do the wrong thing. :p

Eyecandy.
The 3 points here should be exactly the same as for the gameplay. Describe the eyecandy, write down a few examples, tell the author what's good and what's not and then suggest improvements.

Event placement.
Same as for gameplay.

Summary
List some cons and some pros, then tell the author what you think of the lvl overall. Finally, give a rating and your judgement on whether this is worth a dl recommendation or not.

When reviewing multiple lvls, DO NOT, I REPEAT, DO NOT review each lvl in detail as you would do with single lvl uploads. For gameplay, eyecandy and event placement, give some examples for each of the 3 points. Pick the examples from all lvls. The admins will be fooled by this and think that you've looked in detail at all lvls when you haven't actually done so...hahaah! Revenge! :D

Finally, here are two example reviews I wrote beforehand. ;) The reviews look long because of the spaces in them, but you'll find that you will be able to write these kind of reviews in a matter of minutes and that itll also take just as long to read through the whole darn things. :D

This review was written on 10/20/02 and rates the CTF lvl 'Deep in the Jungle' by Super Saiyan.

----------
Ah…first download and first review. Can life be better?

Ok, yes it can, but that’s got nothing to do with this lvl has it? ;)

Ahem.

Deep in the Jungle is Saiyan’s second CTF lvl and to be honest, his first one was better, but only slightly.

The name isn’t very original, but the lvl is. Its structure is both open and tight making players need all the skills they have in order to run around in it as quickly as possible.The secrets are very cool and anyone that knows them by heart will have a big advantage over everyone else. The idea of putting bonus warps into a secret is also nice since it gives campers the opportunity to…surprise, surprise…camp.

The gameplay is really good since there are lots of float ups which stops ppl smashing into walls when they’re running at 250km/h (feels proud about coming up with the float-up idea). Whoever, there are a couple places which requires extended jumping but I guess it adds to the originality since it makes ppl more vulnerable. And as I said, the secrets are very nice to have and so are the well placed springs in the lvl.

The eyecandy is good, but has got nothing special. The secret bonus warp room serves both as a room and as eyecandy (you can only see the roofs of the houses from above). I would prefer to have some more leafes and trees in the foreground because there are so much solid tiles in the lvl and you could put a lot of eyecandy inside them. Apart from those things, there’s nothing original. A couple spikes, eyes in walls, trees, leafes and other jungle stuff.

The ammo placement is good and neat. There’s nothing more to say about it except from that sentence.

Overall, Deep in the Jungle is an excellent CTF lvl with funky music and is suitable for duels, 2 vs 2 and especially public servers. I look forward to playing this. Now the only thing that’s missing is a big WR sign inside the walls.

An 8.5.

Cheers,

White Rabbit.
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This review was written on 11/19/04 and rates Sanctuary by Cell.

----------
Well, I’m not sure how to reach the super secret, but I don’t mind.

I’ll post a more detailed review later. For now, enjoy the short version:

Good use of tileset. Lots of tiles in the sprite layer, which means low detail users will enjoy the fantastic eyecandy too. Maybe a bit more colour, and more spikes?

Gameplay is the best part, definitely. You can run through the lvl very easily, it’s jazz-friendly (thanks to the betetesters) and there are many paths to the bases.

Weapons placement is great, there is always ammo for you and they are easily accesible.

The blue base is easier to defend than the red base, however.

8.2 fow now, but maybe an 8.5(!) if I manage to find the super secret and test the lvl more extensively.
----------

(And yes, I will lengthen it asap ;P).

I hope this helps. :)

[MoonBlazE]

People don't like writing reviews for nothing.
You don't get the point, do you? You already had your reward, the levels.

[Unhit]

Woah WR, nice :D

[LittleFreak]

Eyecandy.
The 3 points here should be exactly the same as for the gameplay. Describe the eyecandy, write down a few examples, tell the author what's good and what's not and then suggest improvements.


That's 4 points. :-P

@ MoonBlaze: I don't care if you say "Thanks!" or not, but it gives the reviewer the feeling the author has read his review and feels good because there actually is someone who likes his work. You sound like you wouldn't care at all and I did not had to write the review.

However, I don't want to start a discussion about that, because it simply doesn't matter at all.

[DoubleGJ]

I have an ugly habit of looking at my upload's number of downloads first. Reviews are important, but usually I don't care if there's very few or none of them. I am always thankful to anyone who played my level / listened to my remix / used my tileset. That's enough for me.

[FQuist]

I have reinstated the one review limit. I'm pretty sure I put it back before but apparently I must have done something to remove it or I never finished it.

[n00b]

You don't get the point, do you? You already had your reward, the levels.
If that was true, then I've gotten the really horrbile prize no one wants when I decided to reivew The Sad Beach. But that's not exactly the case with TDI 2. So the reason of reviewing varies from levle/level pack to level/pack. Sometimes you do it because you're bored, when you want to thank the author, when you want to point out all the good and bad things in a level, or when you just reviewed a really bad level and you want to review something thats pretty good (like TDI 2).
Yeah, thats just my 2 cents, more discussion doesn't have to come from this.

[LittleFreak]

N00b has a pretty good point about this. :-P

Quist, what do you mean with one review limit? Does that mean, an upload can only have one review in the future? That would not be good I think.

[Blackraptor]

He means you can only have one review per upload max.

[LittleFreak]

He means you can only have one review per upload max.

That's what I said. I think that's not a good idea at all. I like reading reviews, and only getting one for months of work is really dissapointing.

[blurredd]

As in a person can't make multiple posts for the same upload. 5 N/A reviews from the same person for one upload isn't really needed.

[Anubis]

To admins: Why are there so many comments and bad reviews on J2O? I report them everyday :p

[LittleFreak]

As in a person can't make multiple posts for the same upload. 5 N/A reviews from the same person for one upload isn't really needed.

Well, so Person A can only make one review, but Person B can make one too? If so, that's fine and I misunderstood Blacky.

[White Rabbit]

No, that's really just 3 points, PHT2, because you'll be putting the suggestions and your opinions together. ;P It's called review-cheating, hehe. :) Make your review seem longer by adding a space, if you want to. :p

[MoonBlazE]

If that was true, then I've gotten the really horrbile prize no one wants
I've gotten presents that I never wanted, do you honestly think it's a good idea to ignore those who gave it to me and thank them for it? Doing that will only cause them not to give you anything next near.

It's a fact. No matter how incredible lazy the author has been about his levels, you still owe him a review of same quality. So, if someone gave you an expensive and creative present, wouldn't you thank them deerly for it?

PHT2 asked me to thank him. How is it rightful that I give him a good present and THEN thank him for taking it when I spent so much creating it? My upload has about 111 downloads now, don't you think it deserve just a little detailed review?

... Can you now understand why I felt disappointed?

@ PHT2: I am of course satisfied with your review. It just doesn't make me hit the floor and gives me 'the idea' about it. Reading a detailed review by someone like Trafton always gives me an idea of what I could've done better and what I actually did really good in the levels. It's not meant as an offense towards you.

[LittleFreak]

I seem to have exaggerated it a bit. Actually it doesn't matter at all. This should not be a discussion about if you need to thank a reviewer or not. Because it simply doesn't matter at all.

However, I know I'm not as good in reviewing as Traft is. ;-D

I saw you got two more reviews, one from Snowball and one from N00b. They are both good and detailed ones (imo) so be happy now. :-)

[FQuist]

To continue on an earlier thing, I don't know if review-exchange programs are a good thing. It could influence one's rating. Person A gives person B a good rating so he gives one in exchange.

[White Rabbit]

I don't think most ppl would do that? ;P Besides, the J2o admins would see right through overrated reviews and review exchanges, right? ;)

[n00b]

[QUOTE=MoonBlazE]
... Can you now understand why I felt disappointed?
[QUOTE]
Even though I don't really accept your view on things, I do understand why you are dissapointed.