JJ2WC III: Duellist Cup Signups

[Nielsje]

JJ2WC Duellist Cup Signup

This is the official thread for signing up on participating in the JJ2WC Duellist Cup 2005! (formerly: Pre-JJ2WC Duellist Tournament) The official rules of the tournament will follow later on, but here are a few small guidelines:
- Tournament works with a Double Elimination Bracket. This means, there’s a winner and a loser bracket. Someone in the Winner’s bracket may lose 1 match, and continue the tournament in the Loser’s bracket. If a player gets defeated in the loser bracket, he’s out of the tournament. In the end, the final will consist out of the Winner’s Bracket winner versus the Loser’s Bracket winner. However, if the Loser’s Bracket winner wins the final, the Winner’s Bracket winner can ask for a rematch, since he never lost a match while the Loser’s Bracket winner did. An example of how this system works can be found here: http://www.jazz2online.com/d3/Pre-JJ2WC-2.htm
- The tournament is open for 32 players. This means, the first 32 subscribers get a place. If there are not enough subscribers, we’ll make it a 16-player cup, with qualification rounds in case there are over 16 players.
- Each match in the tournament is “best of three” This means the final score in rounds will always be 2-1 or 2-0 (or 1-2 and 0-2, ofc.) Matches are played with a neutral host (the players have to find one themselves) Scores should be reported to the Cups’ Supervisor, which I am. You can do this by mail or MSN. Both players will be asked for a confirmation of this game. If the loser claims that he has won the game, the host will be contacted.
- The first two rounds have a duration of one week, after that the rounds will be 0.5 week all, this means that the following time schedule is made:
o Winner’s Bracket round 1 (32 players) – November 5th-11th
o WB round 2 (16 p)/ Loser’s Bracket round 1 (16 p) – November 12th-18th
o WB round 3 (8 p) / LB round 2 (8 p) – November 19th-22nd
o WB round 4 (4 p) / LB round 3 (4 p) – November 23rd – 25th
o WB finals (2 p) / LB finals (2 p) – November 26th-December 2nd
o Grand Final (2 p) – December 3rd. Eventual rematch at December 10th
In case a player can’t show up on a certain time (mainly the latter rounds) they can contact me for another date. Do this in time!

Rules for subscribing:
- Give out the correct information I need! For in the database, I need the following stuff from everyone: Nickname, Nationality, and e-mail address (make this your MSN address if you have one). Example for the stupid among us:
Name: ChippieBW
Nationality: Dutch
E-mail: chippiebw@ncmv.net
If you submit it that way I’ll be extremely happy. Thanks in advance.
- You can only subscribe yourself, and you can only participate ONE TIME.
- Nothing more to say.

The final list of all participants can be found on JJ2WC’s newspage. Again, this is the URL: http://jj2wc.ncmv.net/

[[GpW]Urbs]

Name: [GpW]Urbs
Nationality: Slovenian (not Slovakian)
E-mail: urbsgpw@gmail.com
msn: teh_windsurfer@hotmail.com

Ohh and despite it saying I cant do it, I made a lil agreement with yasco, where we both agreed that the either of us to see this topic first, enters the other one as well. I mean to do that, u choose whether to allow it or not, but he will verify anyway.

Name: Yasco8D
Nationality: Belgian
E-mail/msn :rsyasco@xsdclan.tk

[[GpW]Urbs]

stupid smiley r s y a s c o@xsdclan.tk .

[Bobby aka Dizzy]

I have a few questions that if answered should lead to less confusion down the road, I strongly recommend that a policy is formed to settle these situations, Chippie. I'm sure that a few other problems may arise, I encourage you to think through all possible problems now so you can mitigate long delays.


What happens when two players do not complete the scheduled matches by the deadline? Who advances?
Are matches to be played in a specific mode (battle/ctf)? Who decides the levels?
Are matches to be played to a certain score/timelimit?
How are match times to be arranged? Are they set by you or do the individuals arrange times themselves? What happens when a time agreement can be not reached?
In the case that someone does not show up for an agreed match time how is it verified that the one person (or even both) did not show up? Will missing agreed on times hurt chances if matches are not completed?
How are the starting matches determined?

[R3ptile]

What about the maps? Oh, and I think you mean Winner\Loser <b>Bracket</b>. :p

Name: R3ptile
Nationality: Israeli
E-mail: reptilemt@gmail.com

[snzspeed]

Name: Snooze
Nationality: finnish
Email: ultimatefoo@hotmail.com

[Nielsje]

I have a few questions that if answered should lead to less confusion down the road, I strongly recommend that a policy is formed to settle these situations, Chippie. I'm sure that a few other problems may arise, I encourage you to think through all possible problems now so you can mitigate long delays.


What happens when two players do not complete the scheduled matches by the deadline? Who advances?
Are matches to be played in a specific mode (battle/ctf)? Who decides the levels?
Are matches to be played to a certain score/timelimit?
How are match times to be arranged? Are they set by you or do the individuals arrange times themselves? What happens when a time agreement can be not reached?
In the case that someone does not show up for an agreed match time how is it verified that the one person (or even both) did not show up? Will missing agreed on times hurt chances if matches are not completed?
How are the starting matches determined?



This could indeed happen. In case both players aren't willing to play, it's heads or tails. In other words, I decide who goes on. If, which will be more likely, one player wants to play on the other doesn't, the player who is eager to play will go on. Since this is pretty hard to find out, I'll take a closer look at each case. I will start a conversation between the two players and if everyone claims that they want to play, I'll just arrange a match for them.
Matches are usually played in CTF. This means, if one player wants CTF and the other wants Battle, CTF is the mode players will play in. On the other hand, if both players prefer Battle, Battle will be played. About the levels: this is also arranged by the players themselves. If they can't get a real compromis about which map they'll play on, they should contact me. In that case I'll pick a map from the JJ2WC Mappool (in case of CTF) or a random Battle level. But this is not likely to happen.
Rounds are always played till 5 points or 5 roasts, and a match is won after winning two rounds (best of 3)
Match times are usually arranged by the persons themselves. Again, if a compromis cannot be found, I'll try to solve it through a conversation on MSN. If one player isn't able to play the match at all (because the player is on holiday) it would be the best if the match is played later on, during the next week. If the player with the time problems is still not able then, he has lost the match. If you can't play, you shouldn't have signed up for the tournament.
This is indeed a problem, the best solution would be a screenshot by the host of the match, showing the game with the present player clairly on the names list, including the decided time. If this screenshot seems valid enough, I'll contact the missing player. If he really wasn't present on the right time, he lost the match. If he claims the screenshot is fake, further investigation and a possible new time will be arranged, unless the host and present player can really prove the screenshot is real (in example, by showing chatlogs of the time agreement and letting me join the server etc.) This could all be faked, but that's just a piece of trust. No system is really water-tight, I think. Feel free to come up with a water-tight solution :)
I'll have a look at the first four places of last season, and I'll take care that they are not facing each other during the first rounds. For the other 28 players, the places are just randomly decided.

I hope I answered all questions properly :)

[Superjazz]

Name: Vivando(I'll just prefer this nick for the tourney plz thx ;))
Nationality: Finnish
E-Mail and Msn are both: Double3@luukku.com (But I wouldn't recommend to send much stuff to the mail since I get lotsa spam there and the filter is high. :()

[Superjazz]

I'd also recommend the match host itself to take a screenie...a screenie where you can see both players' ip(F9 twice) from the list so if there'd be some confusion of fakers and such, that could be investigated. :)

[R3ptile]

As for the fakers, just don't let unknown people in

The last tourney didn't have "water-tight" rules and it worked perfectly.
Bob, already thought about participating for a change? :7

[Vegito]

Name: Vegito CC
Nationality: Dutch
E-mail: Vegi_dh_jor@hotmail.com

[cooba]

Name: Cooba
Nationality: Polish
E-mail: coobshop@gmail.com

[DarkSonic]

Name : DarkSonic
Nationality : Dutch
E-mail/MSN : DarkSonic1990@hotmail.com

[Nielsje]

As Shaney got banned from the JCF, I'll sign him up...

Name: Shaney
Nationality: Dutch
E-mail/MSN: maltana@freemail.nl

[R3ptile]

bucket = bracket
fix plz

[ThaSpaz]

Name: ThaSpaz
Nationality: Dutch
Email: Thaspaz@gmail.com

[Grytolle]

Nickname: GrytolleCC
Nationality: Swedish
Email: grytolle@gmail.com - I seldom check it so don't bother.
MSN: grytolle@craccoclan.com

[Ragnarok!]

Im in

Ragnarok
English\Iranian, whatever the hell
sabatazayoni@hotmail.com

[Enigma]

Nick: Enigma
Nationality: Belgian
E-mail: nils _ noppe @ hotmail . com

I'm actually trying to participate in something jj2-ish. Whoo. Imagine that.

[FireSworD]

Nick: FireSworD
Nationality: USA
MSN: akliensmith@msn.com

[Chiyu]

Nick: Chiyu
Nationality: Dutch
MSN: Chiyu@craccoclan.com

Oh and, since he's banned and can't sign himself up:
Nick: Shaney
Nationality: half-Dutch, half-Aruban
MSN: maltana@freemail.nl

[Vegito]

As Shaney got banned from the JCF, I'll sign him up...

Name: Shaney
Nationality: Dutch
E-mail/MSN: maltana@freemail.nl


@ chiyu ;-P

[Yasco]

Name: Yasco
Nationality: Belgian
MSN : rsyasco@xsdclan.tk

Can I also sign up Squirrel?????He will forget to do it...

Name : Squirrel
Nationality : Belgian
MSN : fireball_xsd@hotmail.com

[[GpW]Urbs]

Ohh can I be in the same bracket with shaney? PLZ!!!!!!:)

[snzspeed]

Urbs']Ohh can I be in the same bracket with shaney? PLZ!!!!!!:)
no.

[Superjazz]

yes.

[maverick]

Nick: Sperry
Nationality: Polish
MSN: sperry_ba@hotmail.com

Nick: DeDe
Nationality: Polish
MSN: burek7@interia.pl

Nick: Maverick
Nationality: Polish
MSN: maverickvspl@hotmail.com
(Add me Chippie,if there will be a place left ;p)

DeDe and Sperry agreed,so they don't have to verify?

[Nielsje]

Hmm...
In the first place I only wanted people to only sign up for themselves, but it seems like there are enough places free at the moment. However, if there turn out to be over 32 subscriptions after all, the persons who signed up themselves get priority over people who let others sign up for them. But I won't worry right now, since there are still 13 places left.

[maverick]

So I will make them post here.

[R3ptile]

Are there 32 active players? :!

Edit: I haven't duelled for at least couple of months and I need to get back in shape. If you need someone to practice with, feel free to ask me.

Edit II: According to the statistics, FS should be 3rd, Skull 2nd and me 1st. I can't wait to find out if it's either gonna happen or not. :lol:

[Grytolle]

I haven't duelled for at least couple of months and I need to get back in shape. If you need someone to practice with, feel free to ask me.Hi ;p

[R3ptile]

Yo! We'll duel as soon as the mappool is announced, okay?

[snzspeed]

Edit: I haven't duelled for at least couple of months and I need to get back in shape. If you need someone to practice with, feel free to ask me.


hey ;)

[EarlyBirdPie]

Nick: Pie CC
Nationality: USA
MSN: early_bird_pie@hotmail.com
:lol:

[Grytolle]

Yo! We'll start practicing as soon as the mappool is announced, okay?There isn't a real mappool it seems, but just contact me on msn when you feel like having a game ;)

[CelL]

Nickname) CelL
Nationality) Dutch
MSN/Email) cell_l33t@hotmail.com

[R3ptile]

W0w0w0w it's THA SNOOZY :O

@Gry: No mappool?? what do you mean? :confused:

[maverick]

Chiippie has already said something about it:
"Matches are usually played in CTF. This means, if one player wants CTF and the other wants Battle, CTF is the mode players will play in. On the other hand, if both players prefer Battle, Battle will be played. About the levels: this is also arranged by the players themselves. If they can't get a real compromis about which map they'll play on, they should contact me. In that case I'll pick a map from the JJ2WC Mappool (in case of CTF) or a random Battle level. But this is not likely to happen."

;p

[R3ptile]

:( k

[Vegito]

I haven't duelled for at least couple of months and I need to get back in shape. If you need someone to practice with, feel free to ask me.

*waves* (after 7 days.)

[Quickz]

Nickname) Quickz
Nationality) Dutch
MSN/Email) stephan2456@hotmail.com

[SpybunnyCC]

nickname: Spybunny
nationality: Dutch
email: trunksdbz91@hotmail.com

[Ragnarok!]

Ill sign up GP too.

Name : True musou
Nationality : Unknown
Email: sasan_tazayoni@hotmail.com

[DanYjel]

*me signs me and hopes he will have some free time...*

Nickname: DanYjel
Nationality: Czech
MSN/Email: danyjel [at] gmail [dot] com

[Nielsje]

Time for a temporal list of currently subscribed participants! At this time, the list is as follows:

1) Urbs
2) Yasco
3) R3ptile
4) Snooze
5) Vivando
6) Vegito
7) Cooba
8) DarkSonic
9) Shaney
10) ThaSpaz
11) Grytolle
12) Ragnarok
13) Enigma
14) FireSworD
15) Chiyu
16) Squirrel
17) Sperry
18) DeDe
19) Maverick
20) Pie
21) CelL
22) Quickz
23) SpyBunny
24) True Musou
25) DanYjel
26) –
27) –
28) –
29) –
30) –
31) –
32) -

7 free spots left to divide people! 8D.

Oh, here’s some further information about the end of the signups. They will end when:
a) There are 32 or more subscribers for the tournament
b) The clock has reached Saturday October 29th, 20:00 GMT. One week after the start. At that time, people are no longer be able to signup themselves, and if there are less than 32 people I’ll create some changes in the tournament structure.

I’ll post the final list later here, any further information can be found at http://jj2wc.ncmv.net/ (after the subscriptions have closed, of course)

[[GpW]Urbs]

heh looking on the bright side of things, I might be last on the end, but at least on the list of people who subscribed to play in the tournament, i'm 1st:))))

[Violet CLM]

It's not like I'll win but I feel like taking the spot of someone who might.

Name: Violet CLM
Nationality: Usatarian
E-mail: violetclm@gmail.com (replace "gmail" with "hotmail" for MSN, but I dislike that email account.)
Sandwich: French Dip
Milkshake: Yes

[Sacrush]

Name: Sacrush
Nationality: Dutch
Email: Masterblasterdisaster6@hotmail.com

[SkulL]

Whoa! a 1on1 tournament with 32 players... that's nice!
Count me in!

Name: SkulL
Nationality: Israeli ;D
Email: varshai@012.net.il or Skull1337@gmail.com

It'll be hard since I'm rusty but I'll do my best to win this tournament too.
Anyway,anyone who's intersted in a practice contact me in msn - skullfor@gmail.com

[FireSworD]

Only 4 more slots left. Nothing like this has been attemped on jj2 before. To think if one were to start a 32 players tournament a year or two ago, you'd be crazy. Talk about a game that is 'dying'.

C'mon, don't fear embarasment and sign up. Remember, it's all for the fun, better to fail and really lose nothing but the duels, than to deny a few fun victorys (or losses ;P).

[UNKNOWNFILE]

I wish to sign up!

Info stuff

Name: UNKNOWNFILE
Nationality: Canadian
E-mail: dapete10@sympatico.ca
Website: http://unknown.halleyscometsoftware.com
Sex: No thanks.
Gender: Male

[Vegito]

Only 4 more slots left. Nothing like this has been attemped on jj2 before. To think if one were to start a 32 players tournament a year or two ago, you'd be crazy. Talk about a game that is 'dying'.

C'mon, don't fear embarasment and sign up. Remember, it's all for the fun, better to fail and really lose nothing but the duels, than to deny a few fun victorys (or losses ;P).

I agree :)
(although I sometimes forget it. ;.; )

[BoArDeR]

HiYa. :oDD

I want to, but the timing just SUCKS. I'm so insanely busy I'm afraid that I won't be able to make any matches. It runs right over Thanksgiving break (leaving on a vacation), then creeps up to the holidays, and school finals. Oh man... Oh yeah, and me and my girlfriend might be moving into an apartment right at that time, and that wouldn't be to gentleman like of me to play on a bunny tournament the first month we are together. Haha. OKAY WELL ILL THINK ABOUT IT MORE CUZ I WANT TO DO IT. MAYBE HOLD OFF A SPOT 4 ME AND I WILL LET YOU KNOW IF I CAN MAKE IT!

OKA BYA!

-Bder

[Vegito]

Well, fine, this is the hardest job I've ever done... but...
AJazz wants to join this tournament!

Name: Ajazz
Nationality: Israel
Email: He doesn't have any e-mail, MSN or whatever on which you can contact him.
He doesn't have a JCF account either, but he says that he can check this out a lot..

[EarlyBirdPie]

Nick: ElfpuddingC C or ElfC C
Nationality: USA
msn: elfpudding@hotmail.com

veg made me sign her up :eek:

[Violet CLM]

Only 4 more slots left. Nothing like this has been attemped on jj2 before. To think if one were to start a 32 players tournament a year or two ago, you'd be crazy. Talk about a game that is 'dying'.
http://www.jazz2online.com/jdce/

[Nielsje]

Only one spot left people! Boarder already said he wanted to participate, but he doesn't know for sure. If he does, all places are taken. But some people who are certain they can participate can subscribe themselves.

EDIT: Ajazz's subscription is a bit dodgy, he has no e-mailadress on which we can contact him. I know he's on JJ2 for the majority of the time, but a valid e-mailaddress is certainly a must.

[White Rabbit]

<s>Does that mean I, or just someone with an email address, could push ppl like AJazz off the list if I decide to subscribe when there are already 32 players? :p</s>

[Nielsje]

It's hard, but yes, AJazz will be the first to be kicked off the list, since he didn't register himself which has priority) and has no valid e-mailaddress. However, it's likely that the subscriptions ill closed a few hours after the 32 limit has been reached.

[R3ptile]

http://www.jazz2online.com/jdce/
failed :D

[Vegito]

AJazz :
Chippie, I know its kinda hard with no e-mail, But Im playing jj2 for almost 24 hours a day.
And the jj2 thing is the most basical thing in jj2wc3, dont you agree, Chippie?
Give me one chance to prove myself as a good player! please!
I check the JCF 200 times a day!

(Z0mg, I hate being a messager - Veg)

[Grytolle]

Chippe! I demand you to not let Ajazz play... He's too good ;(

[Anubis]

Bucket > Bracker
Wow a lot of dutch and polish people here :O
Name: Anubis
Nationality: Bulgarian
MSN/E-mail: ninetales93@yahoo.co.uk

[Nielsje]

OK, signups are FULL. We've gathered 32 people, thanks for signing up everyone! :)
There are still a few people who didn't actually follow the rules (they let others sign up for them), so I'll give eventual latecomers till 19:00 GMT (4 hours from now) the possibility to do a final signup, as long as they register for themselves. After that, the signup phase is officially over and the lists will be announced.

[Nielsje]

Good! :)
The list is complete, and all players have been entered in the JJ2WC Duellist Player Database on the website (http://jj2wc.ncmv.net/), more information will be found over there. This is the final list of participants:

1) Urbs
2) Yasco
3) R3ptile
4) Snooze
5) Vivando
6) Vegito
7) Cooba
8) DarkSonic
9) Shaney
10) ThaSpaz
11) Grytolle
12) Ragnarok
13) Enigma
14) FireSworD
15) Chiyu
16) Squirrel
17) Sperry
18) DeDe
19) Maverick
20) Pie
21) CelL
22) Quickz
23) SpyBunny
24) True Musou
25) DanYjel
26) Violet
27) Sacrush
28) SkulL
29) UNKNOWNFILE
30) Ajazz
31) Elfpudding
32) Anubis

Neat list, I think :) Ah well, good luck with the trainings, don't forget to check out the website a few times this week for further updates about the tournament.

[White Rabbit]

I get 404 errors for the Duelist Cup pages. :(

[Grytolle]

Neat. =)

[[GpW]Urbs]

I'm still 1st on the list, so hide u f00s:)

But no, seriously, princess Mononoke is all there is, so why bother?

[DanYjel]

Btw, will be startup groups generated randomly, Chip?

[blurredd]

So let me get this straight: A 32-player double-elimination tournament? If this thing actually works, I'll be really amazed. It would be awesome though.

[Violet CLM]

failed :D
So? All that was said was that nothing of this kind had been <i>attempted</i> before.

[Ragnarok!]

I tried.. Chip never did the site.. :( But this will work. And be sure of it.

[blurredd]

If you say so. Just keep in mind JDCE was a single elimination tournament, wasn't best of three, and managed to fail despite players being able to use JDC duels.

[White Rabbit]

Why did it fail in the first place?

[blurredd]

Probably from a lack of and patience and players signing up who couldn't really participate, and so interest died towards the end.

But considering recent tournaments, a tournament like JDCE would probably work well now. I just have some doubts about the JJ2WC tournament because it requires so many more matches. I'm really curious to see how this all turns out.

[Vegito]

I think this will work out fine, considering that there are a lot of players in this tournament who are active, and who like dueling :-)

[R3ptile]

I just noticed this game is just as active as the Israeli UT2004 community. :p

[White Rabbit]

Oh the <s>sarcasm</s> irony.

[DeDe]

My first post in this forum:) I do not say I in english well good but I think that you will apprehend me. I do not understand very too what for it JDCE and single duels will be on that principle etc.

[Grytolle]

My first post in this forum:) I do not say I in english well good but I think that you will apprehend me. I do not understand very too what for it JDCE and single duels will be on that principle etc. :lol: Okay, no problem

[Vegito]

very clear! thank you. :p

Another day for claiming a page. ;.;

[Grytolle]

Not that there is any chance, but my pal Seph told me he wants to play in this. Bad for him that people signed up so quickly he didn't even notice the signups had begun =D

[DeDe]

When first matches? It what for JDCE? Results are recorded there?

[White Rabbit]

No, JDCE is something different. Results will be recored at jj2wc.ncmv.net

[BoArDeR]

OKay... I guess the whole idea of RESERVING A SPOT was too complex for you guys. ><

Sweet, Thanks. :oP



Have fun kids.

-Bder

[Nielsje]

Well, we can't reserve the last availabel spot for someone who isn't even sure he can play. Maybe if you asked earlier... however, if one of the players decides to not play at all, you're welcome ;)

[Nielsje]

The drawings for this year's edition of the Duellist Cup can be found at our website, more especially at http://jj2wc.ncmv.net/tournament.html. More information can be found at the website.

[cooba]

Oh, and a small suggestion: make sure the not so skilled players get a chance; last years matchups were just sad.In other words, have fun playing, Boarder.

[R3ptile]

Snooze vs. Enig? o.O

Edit: Final Scheme = Champion's Bracket

On a site note, I also think you should add duels for the 5th and 7th place, since there are 32 players.

[SkulL]

In other words, have fun playing, Boarder.

Does that means I'm first matched with Bder? =OOOOOOOO

[White Rabbit]

FS vs Quickz, Elf vs Squirrel...maybe I am unfairly judging some people's skills here, but just look for yourselves. I'd say Rag vs Gry and GP vs Chiyu are the fairest duels in the tournament so far. :p

Maybe Snooze vs Enigma as well.
Hm... *minds control Snooze to drink beer before duel*

[R3ptile]

There shouldn't be fair duels at the first stage (-). :(

Now, instead of the most skilled player, the most lucky guy (the one who got the weakest opponents) would win. Good job ruining the whole JJ2WC 1v1 concept (which should be based on skill only), Chip.

[BoArDeR]

Now I'm just confused. I think you meant "Have fun SITTING OUT, Boarder".

But I just don't know anymore. :o[[

*Runs off to play Counter-strike Source ... with Spoy ... And Samalander*

-Bder

[Blackraptor]

Now I'm just confused. I think you meant "Have fun SITTING OUT, Boarder".

But I just don't know anymore. :o[[

*Runs off to play Counter-strike Source ... with Spoy ... And Samalander*

-Bder


Cooba wants you to take his place Boardu ;P

[FireSworD]

If anyone else wants to drop out: Blacky wants to play. ;P

EDIT: Or if Boarder still can't play, replace Cooba with Blacky.

[Nielsje]

There shouldn't be fair duels at the first stage (-). :(

Now, instead of the most skilled player, the most lucky guy (the one who got the weakest opponents) would win. Good job ruining the whole JJ2WC 1v1 concept (which should be based on skill only), Chip.

I believe I don't see your point. The player with the weakest opponent wins? Look - I don't know what system they use at your place, but normally placed in a Double Elimination tournament are made random-wise. Everything here is random, except for the top 4 players of last year.
I don't think there's a good solution for this problem you state. There are some alternative ways:
1) Seperate all good players from the bad players. In this scenario, duels are fairest (good guys vs. good guys & bad guys vs. bad guys) but in this way, half of the good players drop out during the first round, while players with much less skill proceed. Is this fair? Not at all. People will complain like hell. It might be a tournament which is worth watching, but the skilled players will hate it.
2) Every duel has a good player and a bad player. This is pretty unfair, since the bad players don't stand a chance against the good and so all good players will move on to the next round. In that case, all good player stay in the game (which is good for the later rounds) but new player don't stand a chance. Unfair.

So, the best solution to the problem would be a mixed selection, featuring some duels which are good vs. good, some are bad vs. bad, and others are good vs. bad. I could put all in the players on fixed spots (not randomly decided) but then participants will call me biased and lots of flaming will be my part. So, the only solution which is left is the randomly decided matchups, which I used for this tournament.
I don't see your point at all and telling me "I ruined the JJ2WC Duellist concept" without even giving any arguments is just stupid. If you have a better solution, feel free to tell it, but I've had several positive reactions about the matchups already, so I'm not in the mood for a redraw.

[Blackraptor]

If anyone else wants to drop out: Blacky wants to play. ;P

EDIT: Or if Boarder still can't play, replace Cooba with Blacky.

ahah. please don't do that ;(

[Vegito]

Does that means I'm first matched with Bder? =OOOOOOOO

Big chance that you face me in the second round 8D

Im watching this topic closely =P

[cooba]

There shouldn't be fair duels at the first stage.Apparently there aren't.

[R3ptile]

This is pretty unfair, since the bad players don't stand a chance against the good and so all good players will move on to the next round. In that case, all good player stay in the game (which is good for the later rounds) but new player don't stand a chance. Unfair.

(-) this is just ridicolous. This tourney has always been based on skill only. After all, we want to find out who are the current best duelists and bring JJ2 to it's highest competition level, and that's also the reason I started this tourney from the beggining. We don't give a (-) about "bad players" - if someone is bad, he should be knocked quickly. That's how this tourney always has worked, and you ruined it all now.

Next time don't be lazy and make seedings.

And by the way, lesser skilled players could always try JDC instead.

[cooba]

That's how this tourney always has workedAnd if you bothered to look at the drawings you would notice that it still works like that.

[R3ptile]

Bleh.

Nope, not really. Skull won't be able to face FS, Cell, Enig\Snooze and me at the winner bracket, for example.

And that match between Enig and Snooze at the first round is just a JOKE.

So, as I mentioned, next time don't ignore my suggestions and make seedings. I know we're all human, and we should learn from our mistakes.

[Enigma]

"Has always been based on skill"? It has only had one edition so far. :D

Besides, I don't see any spots in the draw where newer players can charge right into the final stages, let alone win the tournament, without running into several of the more experienced players. And the number of matchups of good (subjective term btw) players against each other in the first round is fairly limited; and given the large number of skilled players in the tournament, it was inevitable that we'd get some crazy first round matchups.

[R3ptile]

It has only had one edition so far. :D
*Two. And if you also count JJ2L, the (failed) tourney that AvK and I were organizing two or three years ago (many skilled players such as Bob, Unhit, Thunder, Sal and others participated and yet you probably haven't heard of it, since it stopped after the groups stage), it makes three. :p

[Superjazz]

I do give a crap about the lesser skilled players. 8D
Though I know you've been always a 'mind-changer', r3p. :rolleyes:

EDIT: Oh, and also if this was meant only for professional players, an idea of 32 players in it would be almost only a waste of time because there sure ain't that much of good active players in THIS community, and more players=more fun. :roll:

[R3ptile]

Now go make sense.


And yes, I'm a mind changer. I can change your minds whenever I want to. Bwahahahaha! }>

*EVIL*

[Nielsje]

Nope, not really. Skull won't be able to face FS, Cell, Enig\Snooze and me at the winner bracket, for example.


This is just a pure lie. SkulL can face both you and FS during the finals, and Snooze during the semifinals. Theoretically, it is possible for ANY player to face another player during the tournament.


And that match between Enig and Snooze at the first round is just a JOKE.


Hahaha.
Now serious, of course not every match is good for the first round, but as Enigma said, something like that is inevitable. If it wasn't Snooze vs. Enig, it would be another match.


So, as I mentioned, next time don't ignore my suggestions and make seedings. I know we're all human, and we should learn from our mistakes.


In your opinion, a JJ2WC tournament should eliminate all new players immediatly. If I'd follow that scenario, it would receive much controverse. New players should get a chance as well.

OK, everyone who still got complaints now can stop whining, the tournament setup remains as it is now.

[R3ptile]

SkulL can face both you and FS during the finals
Only during the WB final.

Either Snooze or Enig will be eliminated from the WB bracket right after the first round, which is unfair.

Now serious, of course not every match is good for the first round, but as Enigma said, something like that is inevitable. If it wasn't Snooze vs. Enig, it would be another match.
Not if there were seedings. ;)

In your opinion, a JJ2WC tournament should eliminate all new players immediatly.
It's not only my opinion, it's also how it's Always been.

New players should get a chance as well.
They got enough chance at practice duels, JDC and JJ2WC, where they could also prove themselves as good players, then get a higher seeding at JJ2WC 1v1.

Edit: Of course it remains as it is now, as it is already too late to do such drastic changes.

[Superjazz]

Either Snooze or Enig will be eliminated from the WB bracket right after the first round, which is unfair.

-_-

[R3ptile]

wat

Edit: Wait, I'm getting it. You probably don't see my points, and that's why you always think I change my mind while I don't. :lori:

[Superjazz]

I don't indeed get the point of what's different if either of Snooze/Enig doesn't manage between into the next round than with anyone else.

[R3ptile]

Huh? What I was trying to say is that it's unfair that two of the best players already face each other in the first round.

[Blackraptor]

I'm more closer to agreeing with R3p on this. I think this should be based on skill rather than luck of the draw. Good luck to everyone, though.

[maverick]

Yeah, it's unfair that I have to face Rep.He will crash me easily. ;((((((((((((((((((

[Vegito]

You can complain about it.
But then again, its useless already.
discissions has been made. now you just have to accept it.
And I think Snooze Vs. Enig will be a close match =P

[[GpW]Urbs]

Hmm I won't complain:)

EDIT: people will so laugh at me when I get knocked out in the 1st stage already:)))))

[blurredd]

Here's my stance:

I somewhat agree with R3ptile, but I don't like the way he presented his argument. Chippie mentioned that it isn't fair for newer players to lose in the first round, but wouldn't that mean the more skilled players don't deserve to win and move on in the tournament? As already mentioned, tournaments are meant to find out who is the best, and therefore should focus on the better players. That's the basic reason why most tournaments use seeding whenever possible.

R3ptile mentioned that the JJ2WC dueling tournament being based on skill was "how it's Always been," but that tournament hasn't been around for that long. A better basis for such an argument is the playoff system used in certain sports. Playoffs are used for the same reasons I mentioned above.

The one thing that wasn't mentioned in its entirety is how seeding would be done. If this was to be done, it would probably be in everyone's best interest to seed everyone. Unfortunately, there isn't any completely fair method from which to derive such seeds. JDC has varying activity from season to season (with scores highly correlated to activity) and the JJ2WC tournaments do not account for everyone. Even if the seeding could somehow be done fairly, some people would still complain. So proper seeding could possibly be a waste of time.

And since this is a double elimination tournament, it doesn't matter quite as much where all the players are positioned in the first round. Good players who get knocked out of the winner's bracket have a decent chance of winning the loser's bracket and possibly the entire tournament. I can't say random seeding is the best solution, but it's better than trying in vain to judge how good players are from limited sources.

[R3ptile]

lol and you think we're bored enough to read all of this?

[cooba]

lol and you think we're bored enough to read all of this?And that comes from someone who wrote this post (http://www.jazz2online.com/jcf/showpost.php?p=316921&postcount=108).

[[GpW]Urbs]

hmm just because some1 actually comes up with some proper argumentation and a sentence longer than 3 words that doesn't mean we have to linch him rep. It actually enriches the discussion and can lead to better solutions on the end, and thats what we all want.

[Vegito]

I actually have to agree with Blur.
Its somewhat impossible to make it totally fair for everyone ;-P
Thats kind of his story's summary :P

[FireSworD]

Uhh...It seems you guys don't have to worry about the matchups, at all.

I've just had the most amazing duel with Quickz: He had me 4-0 in my OWN LEVEL, not to mention his less than impressive history. It's very easy to give up at 0-4, I still won 5-4. That's as scary as it can get.

This is going to be one interesting season.

[White Rabbit]

Please proceed with a War Tavern story about the duel. :eek:
What level did you play in?

[Enigma]

Uhh...It seems you guys don't have to worry about the matchups, at all.

I've just had the most amazing duel with Quickz: He had me 4-0 in my OWN LEVEL, not to mention his less than impressive history. It's very easy to give up at 0-4, I still won 5-4. That's as scary as it can get.

This is going to be one interesting season.

Really now? Remarkable... *ponders* Makes me wonder about something.

[[GpW]Urbs]

hmmz i don't get it, quickz almost beat you, while you were quite the equal of vegito for 20 min later on winning with 5-2...

[R3ptile]

lol fs u r rusty :D

[Chiyu]

And Quickz is improving at the speed of light, compare him to how he was in the summer and you'll be amazed! Giving him JJ2 and recruiting him was a very good idea :)...

[Sasik]

I've just had the most amazing duel with Quickz: He had me 4-0 in my OWN LEVEL, not to mention his less than impressive history. It's very easy to give up at 0-4, I still won 5-4. That's as scary as it can get.

This is going to be one interesting season.

I would rather say: 'Yay for fakers!'. :7

...or not.

[Quickz]

I would rather say: 'Yay for fakers!'. :7

...or not.

Thank you for all the credits, Sasik :+

[Quickz]

Btw... all participants in the Duellist Cup...
I made a thread (like whiterabbit suggested) in the War Tavern for duellist cup match reports...

[Vegito]

Urbs']hmmz i don't get it, quickz almost beat you, while you were quite the equal of vegito for 20 min later on winning with 5-2...

I was somewhat even, back in that duel.
go think that I played for QuickZ or something.
but, you should wonder one thing.
I hosted, and I didn't host with 1.24 or something. QuickZ didn't play with 1.24 either. :-O
And usually, when you host and start another JJ2, you'll lag like (-) :P
I was away for a while in both duels as well, teethbrushing and toilet. -_-'
Go get arguments, instead of "thinking" :p

I would rather say: 'Yay for fakers!'. :7

...or not.

rofl, if you'd be MORE ACTIVE AT JJ2, you would see that he is NOT a faker. thanks.

[R3ptile]

you could always use another computer :p

[Vegito]

bleh, well, I won't talk about that. ;|
still, if I'd use another computer, I wouldn't lose after a 4-0 lead. :P
and FS would totally lag of the server too.. ;P

[R3ptile]

well who knows :rolleyes:

mave, just tell me when you're up for a game

[Chiyu]

Stop the bull(-) faking conspiracy theories Sasik & co, can't you just accept the fact that Quickz is extremely active and getting better every time he plays?

I'll have to quote veg:
Go get arguments, instead of "thinking"

[R3ptile]

or maybe fs is just bad

[Vegito]

I think it went like this:
FS underestimated him, so he didn't play that serious at the start.
QuickZ had a good day, so he sort of pwnd him at the start.
It took a while before FS started playing very serious, more defensive.
QuickZ was like "OMG WHATS HAPPENING HERE" and lost his concentration.
That probably is the reason why FS got such a huge comeback, and why Quick wasn't able to "finish him off"

[[GpW]Urbs]

hmm have to agree with the last one. it's human psychology, that. but ur first post(reply to mine) was a mess veg. Take more time to write more organised replys:)

[White Rabbit]

Btw... all participants in the Duellist Cup...
I made a thread (like whiterabbit suggested) in the War Tavern for duellist cup match reports...

Whoa, wait! The War Tavern is for fictional stories. I was kidding when asking FS, because it sounded like something that would be nice to read about. Real match reports should stay at Jazz Jackrabbit Tournaments.

EDIT: And...what level did you play in? :(

EDIT 2: All right, the thread has been moved and I know what level you played in now...

[Quickz]

Hehe okay
so next time you have to be even more sarcastic :p

[R3ptile]

sorry but it would be too hard to trust you Cracco guys

[Quickz]

Pfff... the things you mean are far in the past, far before i joined the game...
So please do not use those things to me... thnks =P

[BoArDeR]

Haha, this is funny. Simmer down, kids. :oPP

Welp bad/good news. IM GOING ON VACATION AND MY GIRLFRIEND ARE I ARE MOVING TOGETHER THIS MONTH!! :oP YAYYYYY!!! ... See, isn't that good? Yesm, welp, sorry dudes but BLACKU, you're in. Hehe...

Yeah, ever since a couple years ago I kinda formed a life other than JJ2. It's weird. ;o]. Maybe next year.

P.S. I scowl at Vegito's Arrogance.

-Bder :oDD

[Vegito]

What do you mean with the last thing, Boarder?
I don't understand how I could be "arrogant" in any of these posts.. :\
I just defend myself/some others. Im not talking about "OMG IM GOOD" or anything =P
I will wait for your reply..

And R3p, no problem. You don't have to trust me, but, don't suspect anything either until you have hard proof. Which you really won't get :| cause we did not do anything :|

[Blackraptor]

Guess I'm going to have to dig up jj2 again =P.

[maverick]

YAY! =D

[Grytolle]

you could always use another computer :pOr use a command line to open another jj2 window 8)

[NovaStar]

Name: ShadowRabbitRR
Nationality: Australian
E-mail: pinkfurby@hotmail.com

[Vegito]

OK, signups are FULL. We've gathered 32 people, thanks for signing up everyone! :)
There are still a few people who didn't actually follow the rules (they let others sign up for them), so I'll give eventual latecomers till 19:00 GMT (4 hours from now) the possibility to do a final signup, as long as they register for themselves. After that, the signup phase is officially over and the lists will be announced.



That was ages ago, shadow :P

[snzspeed]

YAY i havent dueled for 3 weeks since pc breakdown. and yay im gonna face enigma 8D

[NovaStar]

:'( If only I was informed..
OK! I'll put my name on the waiting list for next year!

[snzspeed]

FS vs Quickz, Elf vs Squirrel...maybe I am unfairly judging some people's skills here, but just look for yourselves. I'd say Rag vs Gry and GP vs Chiyu are the fairest duels in the tournament so far. :p

Maybe Snooze vs Enigma as well.
Hm... *minds control Snooze to drink beer before duel*
no thx

[Grytolle]

beer isnt good 3 u >(

[Enigma]

Whoa! Snooze sighting! Right on the day of the deadline too *gets on msn*

[Grytolle]

Raaaaaag :(

[snzspeed]

And that match between Enig and Snooze at the first round is just a JOKE.

why ? :P

I think it went like this:
FS underestimated him, so he didn't play that serious at the start.
QuickZ had a good day, so he sort of pwnd him at the start.
It took a while before FS started playing very serious, more defensive.
QuickZ was like "OMG WHATS HAPPENING HERE" and lost his concentration.
That probably is the reason why FS got such a huge comeback, and why Quick wasn't able to "finish him off"

hahahaha, i remember i made a comeback from losing 3-9. that was fun

[Vegito]

:'( If only I was informed..
OK! I'll put my name on the waiting list for next year!


Do that, yes. It will only take another 11 months before next duelist championship ;-)

[The Rock-it Rabbit]

Name : The Rock-it Rabbit
Nationatity : Egyption
E-mail : hashisha2003@hotmail.com

[Grytolle]

*points and laughs at TRiR*

[Enigma]

Chippie seems to have sorted his stats system out. Yay for that, though I feel kind of guilty for having my horrible stats boosted by a walkover win. ;)

[Nielsje]

You're right, maybe a 5-0 victory for each forfeited round is a bit harsh, since it wouldn't be fair for the ones that reall won 5-0 and such. Therefor, I might change change this, so that a forfeited round equals a 1-0 victory, or something.

[Grytolle]

That wouldn't be fair either? ;O