My Next Project: Jungle JackRabbit 2

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

I have been thinking about it and decided that my next project is gonna be a sequel to my most popular level pack Jungle JackRabbit.

But anyway, it's hard for me to believe that this level got 6 average score. I personally think it should be much lower. Because the original Jungle JackRabbit level pack wasn't that good.

There are so many problems I can find:


Horrendous grammar. Seriously the grammar is so bad that it makes the text unbearable to read.
Far too many enemies. I didn't even bother fighting most of them, I just jumped over them and walked past them.
By the beginning of most boss battles I'm given a bunch of seekers and a seeker powerup. Which makes the boss fights far too easy.
The levels are too short. It doesn't even take a minute to finish any of the levels.
I have no idea what money is being talked about in the level. What is the villain of these levels talking about?


I could remake this level pack to make the grammar more bearable, and remove the enemies, but I decided instead of doing that, I'm gonna make a sequel.

I don't know when this levelpack will start production, but I will as soon as I can think of a good story with the level. Oh and one more thing, this will be the first levelpack I make where the text has swearing. Of course I will give a disclaimer in the first level of the levelpack. The F word will be used quite a lot in the dialog of the level.

So yeah, that's basically my next project, hope you guys will be looking forward to it.

[Borgia]

Oh and one more thing, this will be the first levelpack I make where the text has swearing. Of course I will give a disclaimer in the first level of the levelpack. The F word will be used quite a lot in the dialog of the level.

But...why?

[Slaz]

But...why?

I'm wondering the same thing. It's not like it's "cool" to swear. In fact, I always feel strange among people who have made the habit of constantly saying the F word in about every sentence. I still keep the literal meaning in mind so it sounds like they want sex with everything and everyone around them all day long.

So unless you're portraying the main character as some stereotypical dudebro American action hero, I don't see reason for much swearing in the dialog of a JJ2 episode.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

The reason I like to use the F word a lot is because I think it's a great filler word. I use it frequently in most of my YouTube videos.

But I won't use it a lot if most of this community is against it. I thought no one would mind since most people I know think of it as a harmless filler word. But since I'm not getting a lot of support for it, I am gonna reconsider it.

Also I need help with something. Since most of the levels will be new areas I'm thinking about making new titlesets for this levelpack. But it's been so long since I last made a titleset that I don't remember how I can make one. Can somebody help me out?

[Slaz]

Reading through http://www.jazz2online.com/tilesets is still the best way to go if you want to have a go at tilesets. Even if you're not good at drawing (like me) you can resort to tools to get okay results. Disguise used Paint Shop Pro 8 in his guide, which is still a good choice, but GraphicsGale seems to be the modern trend when it comes to tilesets and pixel art.

And don't change the way you make things based on what the community thinks. A creative choice shouldn't be limited by an outsiders opinion because they "decide against it". If you feel like using the F word as a filler, then I'd say go ahead.

[Borgia]

That tileset list was last updated in 2004? Well, seems like someone has a lot of catching up to do :P. There are a lot of awesome tilesets out there. A good way of getting them is downloading the latest Anniversary Bash packs, which are full of levels and their tilesets. I don't make sets myself, just happily 'borrow' the creativity of others to build my stuff ^^. With the existing sets there are legions of opportunities for your creations, be they Single Player, Battle, CTF, Tests, whatever.

Speaking of tilesets, I wish there was a night version of Galavant's Gothic tileset. That would be so awesome.

About the other thing: as long as you don't put the F word in every sentence, it should be fine. I just don't see the use of putting it in a dialogue at all, but if you think you should do that, then do it ;).

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

You know what I find sad? The fact that most of the people who criticized my levels when I was a kid aren't even here anymore.

I'm sure they'd love to see a levelpack made by me where actual effort was put into. I'm not joking when I say all the levelpacks I made in 2004 and earlier were made within a day. It is excusable since I was a kid back then.

At least Violet is still around, but he is the only one who knew me back when I was a kid which still uses the site. Almost everyone else joined after I left.

Also, thank you guys for the help. I'm sure I will find out how to make titlesets again. Anyway I doubt I will be done with this before Christmas. At the top of the fact that I'm gonna put actual effort into this levelpack, I also have projects on my YouTube channel to take care of. So I'd say, wait until February 2016 at least. It's very unlikely I will be done before then.

[Stijn]

At least Violet is still around, but he is the only one who knew me back when I was a kid which still uses the site. Almost everyone else joined after I left.
I used to be named Fl@$h, I was around back then. I still have fond memories of your McScrooger and Bad Boys 2 tilesets ;)

[Love & Thunder]

In regards to the swearing thing: I'm not a fan of any kind of filler words(It just makes people sound unintelligent IMO). A tactical F-bomb can have a lot of impact if used correctly, but only if it's used very sparingly.

As for actual advice, make a few different variants of any given tile so as to make different sections of levels fairly easily distinguishable(For example, light walls, dark walls, crumbled walls).
And remember that a level doesn't have to look any good while you're making it, as long as it looks good when it is eventually released.
Also, if something is going to fail, make sure it fails fast. Better for something to fail after a couple of hours' work than a couple of days' work.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

In regards to the swearing thing: I'm not a fan of any kind of filler words(It just makes people sound unintelligent IMO). A tactical F-bomb can have a lot of impact if used correctly, but only if it's used very sparingly.

As for actual advice, make a few different variants of any given tile so as to make different sections of levels fairly easily distinguishable(For example, light walls, dark walls, crumbled walls).
And remember that a level doesn't have to look any good while you're making it, as long as it looks good when it is eventually released.
Also, if something is going to fail, make sure it fails fast. Better for something to fail after a couple of hours' work than a couple of days' work.

That's a good advice. Thank you.

Now I'm gonna respond regarding the swearing. Thank you guys for telling me that I can do that if I want.

Anyway the levelpack hasn't started production yet, I still have to think of all the levels to make and work on the titlesets before I start on the level. And I do appreciate being told that there are plenty of titlesets available, however I stick to making my own titlesets. Since I want people to explore levels that have titlesets unlike any they have seen before.

[Borgia]

Anyway I doubt I will be done with this before Christmas. At the top of the fact that I'm gonna put actual effort into this levelpack, I also have projects on my YouTube channel to take care of. So I'd say, wait until February 2016 at least. It's very unlikely I will be done before then.

Ha, don't worry about that ;). I know from myself that whenever I get a good idea for a new project, it takes months to actually start working on it. Even now I have a number of ideas for new Tests, but I am quite reluctant to get myself to work on them.

In the case of the two Egyptian Tests, I was like: ok, first one is done, I'll get to work on the second one somewhere around 'next week'. That became a handful of weeks. So, don't worry if a project can't be completed as quickly as you think. I think it's quite normal to postpone everything :P. Unless you want to be part of the JCS Awards, then you should create something this year.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

Since Violet CLM is still on the website, I really would like some advice from him as he criticized my awful levels a lot in the past.

So Violet, if you are reading this, could you give me some advice on level making? I won't make the levels too short, and there won't be too many enemies, and unlike back when I was a kid I can now take criticism.

So yeah, I want advice from you as I know you are experienced when it comes to what makes a good level.

[Treylina]

I think it's best to move on from 10 (11?) year old crap and make something anew. It's easier to give tips on something that actually exists. General tips are broad.

If I were you, I wouldn't make a sequel to a pack with poor quality levels. That can give people a bad first impression.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

I think it's best to move on from 10 (11?) year old crap and make something anew. It's easier to give tips on something that actually exists. General tips are broad.

If I were you, I wouldn't make a sequel to a pack with poor quality levels. That can give people a bad first impression.

That's probably a good idea, but the reason I decided to make a sequel to the JungleRabbit levelpack is because it is the levelpack that got the highest rating. 6 average rating is far from great, but it is the highest rating I got on the levels I made during my childhood.

I am not cancelling a sequel to that levelpack just yet, but I am taking into consideration, if I can think of something different, I will probably go with that instead of making this sequel, thanks for the constructive criticism.

[ShadowGPW]

I used to be named Fl@$h, I was around back then. I still have fond memories of your McScrooger and Bad Boys 2 tilesets ;)

WTF YOU ARE FLASH?!?!?!?! Now you tell me?!

[Love & Thunder]

You should just make the pack you want to make. Since you don't know what was going on with the story in the first one, you could just gear it to work as a standalone and leave the connection to the first one as an easter egg/nod to your earlier work.

But really, this is your thing, do what you want.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

I just finished playing all the single player levels I made during my childhood, and they all suffer from the same problem.

There are far too many enemies on the same spot, the levels are too short and the grammar is beyond awful.

I'm glad I played them in a way because now I know what not to do when making a levelpack.

I will let you guys know when this levelpack starts production, but it takes time to think of all the levels and the story, so be patient.

[Violet CLM]

Since Violet CLM is still on the website, I really would like some advice from him as he criticized my awful levels a lot in the past.

So Violet, if you are reading this, could you give me some advice on level making? I won't make the levels too short, and there won't be too many enemies, and unlike back when I was a kid I can now take criticism.

So yeah, I want advice from you as I know you are experienced when it comes to what makes a good level.
Succinctly: steal other people's ideas, but do it at enough of a distance that nobody notices. Look at other games entirely, that way your level design will be different from regular JJ2 stuff because you'll be working in a different direction. Then once you've managed to import that alternate style, think of a way to add a twist to it that wasn't in the original--and that's what's called innovation.

Other thoughts include: Make different areas feel distinct in both visuals and gameplay. Give each enemy its own (gameplay) reason to be there. Implement other obstacles beyond simple enemies. When introducing a new gameplay mechanic, start with the simplest possible form, then expose the player to progressively more difficult versions as you go on, preferably interspersing those with sections featuring <em>other</em> mechanics.

Don't worry about a plot.

[Love & Thunder]

Don't worry about a plot.
This very much.

A good story on a bad game will be ignored, but a great game with a forgettable story is still a great game.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

Well it's official I'm now starting on the levelpack.

Don't expect it to to be done before Christmas, there is no deadline, so it will be ready when it's ready.

Oh and I am using the standard levels are inspirations for the levels I'm gonna make since I personally think they are a good example of levels done right.

I realize that nowadays it's common to modify how the game works, but I'm not gonna do that when I make the levelpack, hope you guys are ok with that.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

I hate to double post, but I need help with something. I tried masking the tileset I'm working on but no matter what color I choose the JCS program just refuses to make it possible to walk on most of the tileset.

I uploaded a ZIP file with both images I tried using on my website host, click here (http://pokeblaze.hostei.com/disclaimer.zip) to see it.

Anyway, I tried every color I could find, and not one of them worked, not one. It was all ignored, and the masks are completely empty. Can someone help me out with this?

I know this might look like a lackluster titleset, but I'm only using it for the first level, and I assure you that will be the only short level, the rest of them should take 5 minutes at least to beat.

[Seren]

Palette indices 0 and 1 become unmasked while palette indices 15-255 become solid. Your mask is entirely filled with palette colors 0 and 1.

[Slaz]

Here's a fail-proof method:

1: Save a copy of your tileset and erase all areas you want to be unmasked.
2: Turn the brightness/contrast all the way up or down, so that your tileset's solid remains are 1 color (black or white).
3: Replace the black or white with a single bright color (like pink or blue).
4: Make a new palette and fill all colors except 0 and 1 with this single bright color.

Oh and last but not least, try to avoid pure black, it'll be transparent. Use (for example) the darkest possible shade of blue to prevent this.

[Borgia]

Succinctly: steal other people's ideas, but do it at enough of a distance that nobody notices.

"Stealing" or "being inspired by"? I think there is a thin line between those, depening on how you look at it :rolleyes:...

When I'm not sure how to do something, like the Layer 6/7 background for a specific tileset, I look for an example to see how someone else did it. Same with animated tiles, if I'm not sure how it can be best animated, I will gladly take inspiration from whatever example I can find.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

"Stealing" or "being inspired by"? I think there is a thin line between those, depening on how you look at it :rolleyes:...

When I'm not sure how to do something, like the Layer 6/7 background for a specific tileset, I look for an example to see how someone else did it. Same with animated tiles, if I'm not sure how it can be best animated, I will gladly take inspiration from whatever example I can find.

I'm sure when Violet said "stealing" he didn't mean literally.

I have come to realize something. It's not just the levels themselves that takes time to make, it's also the tilesets. Since the JCS program won't accept an image with ton of colors (I tried that) I have to find a way to make the tileset look good with limited amount of colors, which is gonna be a challenge.

Since I'm against spoilers I won't tell you anything about the level, since I want you all to be surprised for the most part. I will only show something from the levels I'm making if I need help with something, other than that most of the levelpack will be a surprise.

[Treylina]

It's spelled tileset, not titleset.

With that peeve out of the way, check this:
http://www.jazz2online.com/tilesets/palette.php

There's a dedicated pallette to some things to keep in mind.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

One thing's for sure, I will never use Paint.NET again to make tilesets, I now realize how horrible of a program that is for that.

I'm instead gonna use the program suggested on the tutorial pages there.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

Here is an update, I have decided that I will start production on the first level of the levelpack very soon. I'm now watching a movie, and when I'm done recording my review for said movie I will get to work on the first level of the levelpack.

The first tileset I was gonna make was the castle tileset with a cellphone added. But I now realize it'd be stupid since Spaz or Jazz would be using a small cellphone not a huge one that's bigger than they are.

But one thing I have to ask, and I hope you guys will do everything you can to answer. Does there already exist a tileset that takes place at an airport? I was thinking about making one, but I'm not sure if such tileset exists or not. If not I will make a tileset like that for sure since one of the levels does take place on an airport. Otherwise, not.

[Stijn]

But one thing I have to ask, and I hope you guys will do everything you can to answer. Does there already exist a tileset that takes place at an airport?
I don't think so.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

This is a quote from another thread, but I think it applies to this project as well.

People lose interest in your upload the very moment they see its preview. This is your level:

http://www.jazz2online.com/downloads/previewfile.php?fileID=36342

These are some other recent single player levels that use the same tileset:

http://www.jazz2online.com/downloads/previewfile.php?fileID=35165

http://www.jazz2online.com/downloads/previewfile.php?fileID=35131

http://www.jazz2online.com/downloads/previewfile.php?fileID=24379

People who value their time initially judge uploads by preview, and if it doesn't catch their interest, they don't download. You don't have to spend a lot of time comparing these pictures to come to conclusion your level is not up to standards, and you don't have to download and play it to be able to tell it's probably not worth the time. Notice that the levels I used for comparison are not created by some sort of masters of level design - in fact, two of them come from their respective authors' first ever uploads on J2O.

I didn't download your level and won't review it but if you'd like a breakdown of what's so discouraging about your preview, I can criticize that. First thing that comes to mind is complete linearity - this level is one corridor and several detached rooms one can expect to be connected by warps. When I play single player, I generally want at least an illusion of non-linearity: alternative paths to the same place, small dead ends that contain pickups, secrets, trigger scenery that requires visiting another location, &c. Second but related flaw, this level looks like it could be beaten by simply running and ignoring whatever obstacles it throws at you. It depends on how exactly the rooms are connected and what's in them, but at least the corridor surely doesn't look long enough to lose all hearts by carelessly running through. Third and very obvious is visuals. Your level looks like it may be using only layer 4. There is only one small room in which the purple background is visible and from the preview I'm getting the feeling it's also placed on layer 4. This makes the level look flat and unappealing. Even interiors can use multiple layers to improve visuals. Layer usage is one thing, but the other is how uniform the level looks. All blocks are the same. There's one block you used for solid ground and one you used for background, using other blocks only where the two meet in order to avoid tiling bugs. The Castle tileset offers over 30 variatiations of basic ground blocks and background, and while nobody wants you to fill the level by picking them from the tileset and placing each individually, you should at least put minimal effort into providing some variety (the 'B' JCS hotkey comes in useful). Finally, there's eyecandy, of which this level appears to have very little. I can see some windows, some doors, one armor, one short bridge, and three torches in a single group. The tileset provides you with columns, cannons, vases, chains, and curtains, none of which are in this level. I'm not saying to use all of them, but you have to use a variety and place them often, in configurations that are pleasant to the eye. I think that's about it.

Thank for the the criticism. I will try to make the walls look different in the levels of the next project, and I did check the standard levels and even they have different tiles used in the walls.

Making the walls look different is gonna be an easy task. It is gonna take some time but it's worth it.

[Slaz]

Make sure not just the walls, but also ground and eyecandy is up to standards. Don't overdo it either. Just look closely after applying these details, and if a place feels empty, add or change some stuff. More important may be the gameplay, so either present players with tough challenges and/or come up with fun unexpecting twists that keep the player from getting bored.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

Make sure not just the walls, but also ground and eyecandy is up to standards. Don't overdo it either. Just look closely after applying these details, and if a place feels empty, add or change some stuff. More important may be the gameplay, so either present players with tough challenges and/or come up with fun unexpecting twists that keep the player from getting bored.

Thanks for the help.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

I need help with something.

For some reason "Stop Enemy" doesn't work on tuf turtles, they just ignore it and keep on going.

This is a problem because I don't want them to walk on the entire floor. Does anyone know how I can stop them? Other than adding a masked tile, I don't wanna have to do that.

[Slaz]

For some reason "Stop Enemy" doesn't work on tuf turtles, they just ignore it and keep on going.

I'm by no means an expert on the matter, but I suppose you can alter the default properties of OBJECT::TUFTURT to be affected by AREA::STOPENEMY just like most regular enemies do. Yet I always thought all enemies except bosses were affected anyway.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

Oh of course, I can use angelscript to fix that.

I still haven't tried it out yet, but I am going to since I need it to make the tuf turtles stop when they reach stop enemy like they're supposed to.

Speaking of which I did go to this (http://www.jazz2online.com/jj2plus/plus-angelscript.html) page in an attempt to understand AngelScript better, but all it did was make me more confused about how it works. I have a feeling it will take me a long time to understand it.

[Violet CLM]

JJ2+ partially broke the Stop Enemy event and we didn't notice until a while later, and it hasn't been repaired yet, so that might be what you're seeing. :(

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

JJ2+ partially broke the Stop Enemy event and we didn't notice until a while later, and it hasn't been repaired yet, so that might be what you're seeing. :(

In that case I guess I have to use the masked tile.

Also, if any of you are still worried that this will be like the levelpack I made when I was a kid, don't worry it won't be. All of the levels will be totally different, the only similarity is the villain and the fact that the tileset I used in that levelpack will also be used for some levels on this levelpack. But everything else will be new and fresh.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

No matter how hard I try I just CAN'T understand how AngelScript works, I'm sorry it's just too confusing to me.

But at the plus side the levelpack antidote didn't use any AngelScript (that I'm aware of) and that levelpack got mostly positive feedback, so I think I can make a good levelpack without angelscript. But it is gonna be tough to bring something new to the table, but I'll try.

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

I'm officially giving up on this levelpack for a few reasons:


No matter how hard I try I can't underastand how angelscript works.
The final product will most likely be similar to how the standard levels are like. And I know that style is outdated, and since not many people would be interested in that there is no point.


So yeah, this levelpack won't be happening anymore, which means I have officially retired from making levelpacks. I doubt anyone cares though as the levels I made on my old accounts were horrible. This new levelpack would likely be an improvement, but nobody cares about the old style anymore, everyone wants levelpacks with angelscripts now, which is something I can't master.

[Stijn]

That's not really true... check the downloads section for single player levels rated 7 and higher (http://www.jazz2online.com/downloads/index.php?filetype=4&filesort=uploadTime&filesorttype=desc&filerating=7) and you'll see there are quite a few that don't use AngelScript even though it was available when they were made.

[Treylina]

Maybe I should make a strange scriptless SP level to prove that you can still think out of the box. I have had a couple of unique scriptless concepts (especially bosses) in mind for a while now (yeah, before AS).

[Blaze The Movie Fan]

Ok, I was wrong, I will fully admit that. So I'm no longer giving up on the levelpack. I just assumed angelscript was necessary since I have seen so many levels from last year that use angelscripts.

The levelpack will continue production as planned, except it will take some time since I'm also working on other projects.

[Borgia]

Don't you worry about that whole AngelScript thing :p, I'm stubbornly refusing to learn it as well (for now, at least). It even found its way into tests (just look at Mighty Switch Test for one example), but I rather stay 'old school' and make stuff without using AS.

AS is not on my wish list. First I need to redeem some of my first tests (such as Haunted and Acrid) because of the extremely bad use of their respective tilesets :D. So I'd advise you to forget about AS now, first learn how to use a tileset correctly and how to make a proper SP level. Once you've done that you can continue exploring the possibilities.