Warez, ROMs, and Emulators

[Trafton]

I've noticed lately that many people seem to be recommending/asking how to obtain/talking about Warez, ROMs, and emulators on the JCF. It is true that there are strict anti-Warez rules, but it seems that many people ignore them.

Warez
The most common retort to saying that Warez is illegal seems to be that it does not hurt anything. This is absolutely untrue. Sites caught pushing Warez often get taken down from the Internet, sued, or frowned upon. Also, the "it helps Jazz 2" excuse is just as senseless. It may get another player to JJ2, but most players leave quickly. Besides, Warez does not help JJ2's future at all. Also, Warez is illegal. Whether or not the person who distributes it thinks that they are doing the right thing, what they are doing is illegal.

Emulators
I don't really know huge amounts about emulators, so be free to correct any misstatements I make. From what I've seen, emulators pretty much just allow you to play a game that wouldn't normally run on the PC (such as a GBA game) on the PC in "ROM" form. While I'm not sure if emulators are illegal or not, I'm pretty sure ROMs are, and I haven't heard of any other use of console emulators than playing ROMs.

ROMs
Some people say that ROMs are legal if you own the game. I'm not 100% sure if this is false, but I'm sure that people would not download a ROM for a game that they already own. Another thing many people say is that if you delete a ROM after twenty four hours, it is perfectly legal. I recall reading somewhere that this is not true, and even if it is, most people would not actually follow that rule.

I wanted to say this because I'm tired of people suggesting ROMs and/or Warez of games. They are both illegal. Whether one person thinks they are right morally or not, they are against the law, and it's really just not worth it. And, for those who insist on distributing/downloading such illegal things, I ask that you do so off the JCF. It's in the rules when everyone signs up, and I really hate seeing illegal content, as if there is too much of it, it could get J2O in trouble with their web space provider.

It's really not worth the trouble it could cause, in my opinion.

Trafton: Grammatical edit. The last sentence wasn't supposed to mean what I wrote previously.

[Radium]

ROMs can be legal. I know people who have bought a game which they don't have the system for, and then downloaded a ROM of it to use on their PC.

[Trafton]

I'm sure there are a few cases where people used them legitimately, but those are fairly rare. I'm not even sure if downloading them if you have the game is legal anyway.

[EvilMike]

Originally posted by Trafton

Also, the "it helps Jazz 2" excuse is just as senseless. It may get another player to JJ2, but most players leave quickly. Besides, Warez does not help JJ2's future at all.



I don't think you have thought much about what you are saying. While many players do leave after a short period of time, many others stay. Warez is BY FAR the easiest way to obtain jj2, as purchacing it is nearly impossible for some people, and even if they do have the ability to purchase it, it is usually though the internet via a fan realtor. To send money to them, you would require sending credit card or other secure information to them through a relatively unsecure connection, not to mention that you are sending such information to someone you don't even know. Of course, you could do it by mail, but sending money through the mail isn't a great idea either, and neither is sending a cheque. An international money order is the only truily safe way to do it, and banks charge a fee to have one made.

You say Warez does not help JJ2's future at all. Well, consider the alternatives. No warez means almost no new players. This game has been abandoned totally by its developers, and hoping that it will someday be revived is just wishful thinking, at best. I know the game was redistributed, but that was in very limited quantity and only in parts Europe.

Finally, even if you DO manage to buy the game, I guarantee to you that none of the money you spend will be going to the creators of the game via royalties, or if it does (pretty much impossible), it will be an insignifcant sum of money that no one really needs.

I am not usually a warez supporter. If a game is available in stores or a trusted online one, go buy it. If a game has been abandoned, forgotten, and taken off the markets, that's a different story.

Gasp. I promoted something illegal. I guess I can kiss my soul goodbye now.

[Trafton]

To an extent, that is true. Warez is really the only way that people can still get Jazz 2 today. But that isn't what I was trying to focus on with this topic. I'm saying that people giving out Warez via the JCF is not a good idea, since it could cause legal difficulties. And I'm not just talking about Jazz 2 Warez. Some of the links here link to various other games and emulators that are still readily available in stores. I do not really support JJ2 Warez, but I realize that it is often the only way to get Jazz 2. What I'm really against is mass distributions of Jazz 2 to people who never asked for it (like "Jazz 2 Gold.") They are very unlikely to stay on the game. The same with the JJ3 demo. And, all in all, I think that people should keep Warez off the JCF in general. If they must do it, they should do it privately. But that's just my opinion on it.

[Radium]

[ noob ]

What's Jazz2Gold?

[ /noob ]

[Trafton]

"Jazz2Gold" is/was a CD that contains all versions of Jazz and Jazz GBA...quite illegal, and really a bad idea.

[Xion]

This is from a Rom site...

DISCLAIMER:
You may only download these NES ROMS if you own the respective official cartridges.
If you don't, you must delete the NES ROMS in 24 hours (or less).


Therefore, Roms are legal if you possess the cartrige. I've been in the Rom area for quite a while...**** blockbuster is owned by the ******* SONY...

[MaGoo]

Unless you're a complete idiot, you'll never get caught getting games and ROMs off of sites like Warez. On the other hand I don't use Warez, it has too many viruses. If I want to get a game for free, I just use some other program that'll do the same thing. Even though Warez and all of those other places are illegal, there's really nothing anyone can say that will stop those who do these things. As for Warez distributing Jazz, I think it's a great idea. We need as many people to play this game as we can get. Let's face the facts, Warez is here to stay. At least, until something better comes along.

[Xion]

yeah...I think that JJ2 on P2P servers is fine, as long as nobody speaks of them in this place.

[Violet CLM]

The ROM 24 hour rule is actually not legal at all. I've looked it up, and it's just a scheme to get you to download them.

[Trafton]

Originally posted by Unknown Rabbit
The ROM 24 hour rule is actually not legal at all. I've looked it up, and it's just a scheme to get you to download them.
That's what I thought. I can't think of any reasons why it would make sense.

What I really object to is Warez for games that you can still purchase, such as JJGBA.

[KRSplat]

I don't think that warez is good. But I think that it is neccessary.

(EDIT: I just posted something that goes through the most logic possible from an inferior like me. Now I post this vague crap. Blegh.)

[Xion]

yes, some places have games you can buy in the stores, but lemme ask this: Would you pay 35-45-50 dollars for a game NOW, or wait a few hours for the game to download for FREE?

I see it as no difference, you still have to pay for it one way or another.

[Trafton]

I'm not sure I see what relevancy that has. Most people would rather not pay anything and download a game fairly quickly. For games that are already out and available in stores, I think that Warez is just a way of avoiding paying money. And that's just like stealing.

[Radium]

"Warez is just a way of avoiding paying money. And that's just like stealing." I need to quote that =P.

[Tubz]

The lowdown is that you can blame video game companies and stores about the download of ROMS and Warez. If the prices weren't so high, people wouldn't be downloading it. It is much cleaner buying the store version over a net version.
---------------------
Now Trafton, let me correct you on your first post you said after 24 hours. Actually it was within 24 hours.

For now that's all I have to say.

[Blackraptor]

Warez sucks, it gives out free games which are suppose to only be sold in stores or bought from the internet. I have no comment about roms, for i didnt have much conteact with them. But i never knew emulators were illegal.


Info on emulators: They are basically games for gameboy and gameboy advance wihhc you can play on the computer with a special device downloadable from the same site as the emulators. I have several emulator games, and the system, but i never knew they were illegal:O
My gosh, im not going to download any emulators anymore, for i dont want to get fined or arrested or get a parking ticket or stuff like that:p

[Derby]

Originally posted by JJ Tublear
The lowdown is that you can blame video game companies and stores about the download of ROMS and Warez. If the prices weren't so high, people wouldn't be downloading it. It is much cleaner buying the store version over a net version.
---------------------
Now Trafton, let me correct you on your first post you said after 24 hours. Actually it was within 24 hours.

For now that's all I have to say.

"If the prices weren't so high, people wouldn't be downloading it."

Then again, if people would not be downloading it, the prices would not be so high. Think about it. Since more people are downloading illegal software, companies are not making as much of a profit. In order to get the maximum amount of profit possible, the companies need to squeeze out more money from consumers that do legal business trades. Price is the one thing you certainly should not be complaining of, no matter what you think. Developers make software for money; money that feeds his or her family. You might be saying to yourself, "eh, I think they are making too much money." Fine; when everyone who uses the software starts thinking like that and acting upon it, there will be no company; that developer that was making "too much money" has lost his or her job and is possibly making less money than is necessary. Of course, this might be an extreme application, but it is true nonetheless. It is comparable to theft mainly because that is just what it is: Theft. The bottom line is, price is a reason for illegal practices, and like just about every other reason there is for being involved in such practices, is by no means a valid one.

As for the twenty-four hour rule; I do not know much about the legal topic of emulation, but I can make a strong assumption that it was completely made up.

[Trafton]

I agree with Derby. The video game companies are trying to make a profit. It is their right to attempt to do so. It's not the big corporate executives you hurt; it is the low-paid game designers that truly take the burden when someone downloads something illegally. Also, Tublear, that is not an actual legal truth. It's just a scam to get you to download them. While it is true that the video game sector has inflated prices, that is their right, and that does not make theft legal at all.

[Link]

There is definitely no 24-hour rule for ROMS, and unlike software, you are not allowed to make backup copies. Quoted from any Nintendo game manual:

WARNING: Copying of any Nintendo game is illegal and is strictly prohibited by domestic and international copyright laws. "Back-up" or "archival" copies are not authorized and are not necessary to protect your software. Violators will be prosecuted.

[Xion]

but the problem here is that there is no way of proving that you have these files. Just one press of a button and *oops!* did you need that evidence? It can be gone that quickly.

And by the way, the emulators themselves are not illegal, it's the roms that are.

[Bobby aka Dizzy]

Not exactly Xion, when files are deleted they still remain in memory until other things overwrite them. So on large hard disks or different operating systems, things can stay around for months or longer after they have been deleted.

[Trafton]

Indeed, files stay on your hard drive. There is no manner in which you can completely destroy a file simply by deleting it; overwriting it, however, is another matter. It is true that it is possible to completely eliminate something from your hard drive, but that does not mean what it was was any illegal. No one is going to sue you for downloading ROMs, but that isn't the point.

[Xion]

so the only fine I'll get is a gut feeling knowing that I'm ripping a company from about 300-400 bucks of software?

[Link]

so the only fine I'll get is a gut feeling knowing that I'm ripping a company from about 300-400 bucks of software?

You can get more than that if you're caught. And a good way to get caught is blatantly advertising your usage\possession of warez.

With that statement you just made, the admins could potentially report you to your ISP, who will in turn get your name and address and tell the police about your warez problem. I'm not saying they'll do that, but they could.

[MaGoo]

Have we talked about MOD chips yet? So far, I don't know of many MOD chips out there except for the Playstation, but I'm sure there's going to be more coming out soon, unless Microsoft, Nintendo or Sony fixed that little problem.

[||Slim]

modchips roxor... are they illegal? i know they just void your ps2 warranty.

[Xion]

I don't think modchips are illegal, just not accepted.

And I use a P2P program for my downloads, so I'm already in trouble there. WinMX rules.

Besides, they won't know a thing if all the evidence is removed properly. :)

[Trafton]

I'm pretty sure that they are illegal. Game companies outlaw pretty much any modification to the game to allow you to operate it in an abnormal way. There is probably a highly general law that covers this.

Xion, avoiding prosecution isn't the point. It's wrong, whether you get caught or not. If you kill someone and never are caught, that doesn't mean that you are innocent.

[Krezack]

Originally posted by EvilMike
purchacing

You spelt the above word incorrectly.:cool:

[Tik]

Originally posted by Trafton
convers Trafton also spelled this wrong. Shame on him. What kind of Derby spawn is he supposed to be when he misspells "confirm" with "convers".

Anyway...I had a big long speech about this...but I lack the time and effort to type it out.

[Trafton]

What kind of Spaztic-spawn Spaztic thinks I'm trying to say "confirm" when I just accidentally added an "N" into "cover"? ;-P

[Krezack]

Originally posted by Trafton
What kind of Spaztic-spawn Spaztic thinks I'm trying to say "confirm" when I just accidentally added an "N" into "cover"? ;-P

What about the 's'? Everybody forgets the 's'. :(